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perineal massage pain

Last post 01-11-2011 9:31 PM by midwifea. 14 replies.
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  • 12-14-2010 6:01 PM

    • morae
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 12-15-2010
    • eugene oregon
    • Posts 12

    perineal massage pain

    My doula is out of town for a few days, and i need some advice.

    I am 35 weeks pregnant with my third child and have started my perineal massage with my partner. he is very gentle and tries very hard not to hurt me. however i am in allot of pain now. i feel very bruised and sore, as i did not do perineal massage prior to birthing my other two children, i do not know how much of this is normal. it is painful to walk and to void (not a bladder infection pain, but a bruised pain) i really just feel like i want to sit on an ice pack all day, the feeling reminds me allot of how i felt after birthing my other two. is this normal? are we being too agressive? do i need a couple days to rest down there? do we need to tough it through and keep massaging every day?

    my concerns are that i dont want to damage or irritate the tissue too much. and i certainly do not wish to go into labor already tender down there!

    any advice or suggestions will be well accepted and appriciated! thank you

  • 12-14-2010 11:30 PM In reply to

    • midwifea
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-12-2009
    • Kailua Kona, HI
    • Posts 475

    Re: perineal massage pain

    Morae,

    A couple questions:  did you have injury or repair to your yoni with your previous births?  Do you feel you need to be more prepared in your tissues for this birth?  Can you explain in a little more detail about how you are doing the massage?

    With out knowing you or the reasons for the perineal massage, my advice would be don't do it any more if you are having pain!!  Relax your bottom, use some homepathic arnica tablets for tissue injury and repair, enjoy your last time of pregnancy with out pain.  It should not be tender or painful after your massage.

    Blessings,
    April
    moderator

    "The Voice

    There is a voice inside of you
    That whispers all day long,
    "I feel this is right for me,
    I know that this is wrong."
    No teacher, preacher, parent, friend
    Or wise man can decide
    What's right for you--just listen to
    The voice that speaks inside."
    — Shel Silverstein
  • 12-15-2010 12:07 AM In reply to

    • morae
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 12-15-2010
    • eugene oregon
    • Posts 12

    Re: perineal massage pain

    15 years ago with my son i tore, but healed up nicely. no tearing with my daughter 13 years ago. i have a feeling this baby is going to be bigger, plus it has been a number of years since i have given birth, so i thought massage might be a good idea. i was not told to do it or that i needed to, i was just trying it as a prevenative measure. however, i dont want to further tramatize my tissues, and am currently (while sitting on an ice bag) thinking i may be better off just trusting my body and allowing for what ever happens at birth.

    i had tried doing the massage myself, but at this point my arms simply are not long enough for me to reach down there and do any real massaging. i have been sitting in a  reclining position and applying a warm rag till it cools, then my partner oils up his fingers and gently cominces the massage. we are following the technique our doula taught us, along with several articles we've read that even came with pictures. we watched a video and have tried to do the gentle stretching it suggests.

    mostly he uses two fingers gently sliding them in and runnign them back and forth while gently stretching down and out, just like our doula showd us. the first time there was some tinggling and discomfort as we had heard discribed, but by last night i coud barely handle him touching me and it was flat out painful. now today i am in a good deal of pain, hurting when i walk, sit or try to void (as i mentioned). the cold pack seems to help some. i had my hunny check me this evening after a nice long shower to make sure there was no apparent trama or tearing, he said no it just looks irritated and swollen.

    not sure thats enough detail. but not sure how to explain further.

    oh not sure if this effects things but the dr has had us on no sex the whole pregnacy so i really havent been touched down there in months! there were placental issues that where causeing concern.so all of my yoni tissues are very sensitive and extra touchy.

    i will try to get some arnica tablets, i dont have any on hand, and the idea of applying any salves doesnt sound good!!! and think i'll take your advice and just relax and enjoy things as much as i can without bringing on un- needed pain. my tissues will get enough work out soon enough without me iritating them now!

    and thank you for your confirmation, i had heard discomfort and tinggling durring massage was normal, but nothing about pain after!

    all my thanks! morae

     

    (sorry about spelling)

     

  • 12-15-2010 9:26 AM In reply to

    • midwifea
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-12-2009
    • Kailua Kona, HI
    • Posts 475

    Re: perineal massage pain

    Morae,

    That was a beautiful reply.  Everything sounds like it was done right and with great intent, the only other question I would ask is; what type of oil was used?  Some oils can cause an allergic reaction.  I had a mama who had very sensitive skin, a redheaded, freckled mama and she would have pain with lovemaking all through her pregnancy.  Really irritated yoni. It wasn't until her birth when I used her organic coconut oil on her yoni as baby was near and saw her yoni swell and tighten did I realize she had a reaction to coconut oil and stopped it at once.  She said , oh we've been using that organic coco oil for lovemaking all through my pregnancy because I felt a little dry!!  (I only include this anecdote because it may help someone else)

    Arnica should really help,  The hormones of labor will help stretch and loosen your yoni. as will freedom to find your own birthing position, especially with a big baby.  Slow crowning of your baby's head by just breathing baby out. Visualize this part of birthing.

    I send you good thoughts of warm, stretchy, healthy, opening yoni around a beautiful crowning head and

    Happy Birthing!

     

    Blessings,
    April
    moderator

    "The Voice

    There is a voice inside of you
    That whispers all day long,
    "I feel this is right for me,
    I know that this is wrong."
    No teacher, preacher, parent, friend
    Or wise man can decide
    What's right for you--just listen to
    The voice that speaks inside."
    — Shel Silverstein
  • 12-15-2010 3:09 PM In reply to

    • morae
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 12-15-2010
    • eugene oregon
    • Posts 12

    Re: perineal massage pain

    i thought of the oil issue and we tried a couple diffrent ones. cocoa butter, coconut oil and seaseme oil. i do have sensitive skin, but usually its a reaction to additives and ive used all of these on my face and whole body at one time or other. i cant help but think that if it was an allergy it would wash off and feel better sooner. but i could be wrong. either way i think its great info for others!!!

    i am planning a hypno birth and with the hormones i think your right and i really shouldnt worry about it. things will stretch adn relaxe and she will come.

    thank you again so much!

  • 12-15-2010 5:13 PM In reply to

    Re: perineal massage pain

    I know that there are doulas and midwives who recommend perineal massage, but I have found that it causes more tissue swelling and breakdown.  That's my anecdotal experience.  I try to compare it to when you've got a dental appt, you don't massage the corners of your mouth and your lips to get ready for the appointment becuase if you did you'd end up with a really sore mouth.  I feel that a woman's body will stretch and open to accommodate her baby nicely and if--*if*--if--she needs to open more, her body will adjust and help her. (Notice all those "ifs" in there?" Wink)  I hope you feel better soon.

     

    Susan
    Moderator

    I get up every morning determined to both change the world and have one hell of a good time. Sometimes this makes planning my day difficult. --E.B. White
  • 12-16-2010 2:29 PM In reply to

    • morae
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 12-15-2010
    • eugene oregon
    • Posts 12

    Re: perineal massage pain

    really good point! cant imagine what my mouth would feel like, lol.

    i have gotten past ice packs and have been doing a warm compress at least once a day, that feels like heaven! i have been taking the arnica and i swear it started working imidiatly! everything feels so much better now! i even picked up an extra bottle arnica tablets for after she arrives. i figure it will really help out healing! thank you for sucha  great idea!

    on one hand the massage sounded like uscha  great idea, but on the other it feels like it was causing much more damage than could possibly be helpful. im now on board the trusting my body train and will be just letting it do its own thing!

  • 12-17-2010 6:43 AM In reply to

    Re: perineal massage pain

    Great! And you don't even need a ticket to get on that train!  What's that lyric from the old song, "Peple Get Ready?"--"Faith is the key.  Open the doors and board her."  (I constantly see parallels to birthing in every lyric in every song.  Drives my kids crazy.  Although I can't find a parallel in "Grandma Got Run Over By a Reindeer.")  I go by the old hippie adage, "If it feels good ... do it."  So by the opposite token--if it ain't feelin' good ... stop it!

    Susan
    Moderator

    I get up every morning determined to both change the world and have one hell of a good time. Sometimes this makes planning my day difficult. --E.B. White
  • 12-17-2010 10:56 AM In reply to

    • midwifea
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-12-2009
    • Kailua Kona, HI
    • Posts 475

    Re: perineal massage pain

    Susan,

    It's official, you are the newly elected president of the OFC.

    Blessings,
    April
    moderator

    "The Voice

    There is a voice inside of you
    That whispers all day long,
    "I feel this is right for me,
    I know that this is wrong."
    No teacher, preacher, parent, friend
    Or wise man can decide
    What's right for you--just listen to
    The voice that speaks inside."
    — Shel Silverstein
  • 12-18-2010 6:20 AM In reply to

    Re: perineal massage pain

    I will serve with pride. Yes

    Susan
    Moderator

    I get up every morning determined to both change the world and have one hell of a good time. Sometimes this makes planning my day difficult. --E.B. White
  • 01-10-2011 11:40 PM In reply to

    Re: perineal massage pain

     Perineal massage is one of those topics of debate. When people ask if they should do it our recommendations are to try it but if it is uncomfortable to not do it. If you are becomming sore you could try it without rubbing the fingers in the vagina but just pressing downward with gentle pressure to stretch the muscles to a point where it doesnt hurt. Tears may be more likely to occur if your bottom is swollen at the time you go into labor. The key to not having a tear is a for the baby to come out slowly. If you didnt push long with your last baby you could try gently pushing between the contractions or sometimes just the contraction is enough to easy the baby out with little pushing at all. I have personally found lubricants to help at delivery. One of the places stocks astroglide. Just a personal preference.

    Jared Kennedy
    CNM/FNP (student)
    University of Colorado
    C-EFM, RN-C Inpatient Obstetrics
  • 01-11-2011 2:23 PM In reply to

    • morae
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 12-15-2010
    • eugene oregon
    • Posts 12

    Re: perineal massage pain

    Well, had the little one last Friday, Jan 7th at 9:16 am. Not only did I not tear but I have had no swelling, soreness, pain, nothing! So apparently I really didn't need the massage! Glad I got advice from you guys and stopped when I did! Thank you so much ladies!!!

  • 01-11-2011 3:27 PM In reply to

    • midwifea
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-12-2009
    • Kailua Kona, HI
    • Posts 475

    Re: perineal massage pain

    And the birth went??  GBS concerns?  Baby's weight?

    Just curious...

    Blessings,
    April
    moderator

    "The Voice

    There is a voice inside of you
    That whispers all day long,
    "I feel this is right for me,
    I know that this is wrong."
    No teacher, preacher, parent, friend
    Or wise man can decide
    What's right for you--just listen to
    The voice that speaks inside."
    — Shel Silverstein
  • 01-11-2011 7:55 PM In reply to

    • morae
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 12-15-2010
    • eugene oregon
    • Posts 12

    Re: perineal massage pain

    omg birth went wonderfully, i have photos posted on face book if anyone would like to see. http://www.facebook.com/album.php?id=1484533908&aid=96814

    i had a great doula and my daughter also attended. the two of them worked together as a team and really helped me focus and center! i had back labor and at times the back pressure was really intense. my doula worked allot on counter pressure while my daughter did soothing gentle touch on my face, head and neck. she had never attended any birthing classes hypno birthing or other wise, yet intuitively just picked up on what to do! (shes 13 btw) was amazing having the two of them there and working together for me! daddy was a bit overwhelmed so was present and doing what he could but not as involved and touchy feely as i needed so was nice to have daughter to pick up what i needed when daddy couldn't.

    its funny i kind of went from doing some rhythmic swaying on the toilet since it was comfortable just going with the waves and flowing, to standing and bent over leaning on the bed. i did that right up to full dilation (we were only at the hospital less than 2 hours! water broke at 5:30 am and she was delivered at 9:16 am). i hadn't let them check me so they almost didn't call the dr in time. i kept trying to communicate but i don't think they believed me, sadly they refused to call him till i let them check me and when i did i was fully dilated and she was coming!

    as the pushing phase started i got up on the bed with a squat bar and honestly don't remember if i knelled or squatted. my doula continued to do allot of counter pressure on hips and back (was wonderful!!) and at some point my daughter backed off to let nurse and dr in. dr sat by until last minute when he gently guided oriya down onto the bed.

    it was so amazing, i was so centered! i could feel my cervix opening the whole time and feel her working her way down. i felt her little head as i was crowning and remember the little pop as her head emerged. i had wanted to touch it and my doula reminded me, but that was not what my body wanted and at the time i was very much just listening to my own body and it said to hold my position and not stop the process to feel her, instead i just finished up delivering her. very easy very joyous birth!!! just amazing!

    and as i said i had no swelling or soreness after!!! honestly 4 days latter and i do not even feel like i gave birth! not the slightest tenderness any where but uper back and that's from boob counter weight, lol. my only soreness at all after was my legs and arms, i felt like i had a good work out and that was it!

    i think i adressed teh GBS status on my GBS thread and hate being a broken record, lol.

    to recap the GBS issue, they never had time for their antibiotic treatment in the first place and i wouldn't let them. this made the nurse very nervous but i was adamant and well informed. i was clear and concise and gave my reasons. i told them i was willing to sign a release form and requested the wash instead. which is not a common practice for them.

    kinda funny i didn't sign the forms or do any paper work till after shed been born, they never had time to fill out paper work, good thing i was preregistered!

    oriya has no signs of any GBS issues and they did a blood test. of course i sweat like crazy during my labor and my doula said i was totally sweating out garlic, so my system seemed to have allot in it, yay! think there is a high likely hood my garlic and yogurt regiment helped on the GBS front.

    oriya's birth weight at 38 weeks to the day was 6 lbs 13 oz. her length was 20cm. this makes her my largest baby yet. my son was 6 lbs 8 oz at supposedly between 35 and 36 weeks and 18 cm long. my other daughter was 6 lbs 2 oz at 38 weeks and also 18 cm long. (oriya was due on her big sissy's b day) oriya's weight when we left the hospital was 6 lb 6 oz and today at 4 days old and her first baby well check was up to 6 lbs 7.4 oz.

    i know that was way more of a lengthy answer than required, lol. just felt like sharing.

  • 01-11-2011 9:31 PM In reply to

    • midwifea
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-12-2009
    • Kailua Kona, HI
    • Posts 475

    Re: perineal massage pain

    Welcome Oriya, and well done mama!  Lovely birth story.

    Blessings,
    April
    moderator

    "The Voice

    There is a voice inside of you
    That whispers all day long,
    "I feel this is right for me,
    I know that this is wrong."
    No teacher, preacher, parent, friend
    Or wise man can decide
    What's right for you--just listen to
    The voice that speaks inside."
    — Shel Silverstein
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